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John Miller Elgin Grade SummaryHere are my notes about the serial number counts created by John Miller and published in Roy Ehrhardt's "Elgin Watch Company" book. This file consists of short notes about particular grades and what errors I could find. Each group starts out with two lines about the grade in question. The first line shows my records of the grade, the second line shows the numbers that John Miller came up with. Following these grade lines are comments about the discrepancy. I guess a final comment on the subject: I list a lot of errors in John's work while I list none in mine and that might make John's work sound unreliable. Actually, I am quite impressed with his work. Of course I resolved all the errors in my work by checking against his, I just didn't keep notes about my errors.
who grade total runs first sn last sn class size code jewels Adj/name
mine 100 5000 4 1857001 2228000 12 18s c3g6p 15j ?
EWC 100 7000 5 1857001 7223000 12 18s c3g6p 15j ?
error in EWC:
7223000 is grade 109, not grade 100
mine 109 315000 68 4212001 8219000 60 0s h3g1p 7j
EWC 109 313000 67 4212001 8219000 60 0s h3g1p 7j
error in EWC:
7223000 is grade 109, not grade 100
mine 148 33885 34-3 5917001 11881000 9 18s ofn5p 15-17j Adj / GMW
EWC 148 33786 30 5917001 11881000 9 18s ofn5p 15-17j Adj / GMW
error in EWC:
this is related to the 283 problems as many of the 148 runs
were split into 148/283. See the 283 description
mine 251 3100 2 8692001 9786100 61 18s hfg2l 7j
EWC 251 3900 2 8692001 9787000 61 18s hfg2l 7j
error in EWC:
this is related to the 309 problems. The ending SN is
wrong. this run was split into 251/309 and it looks like John
Miller took the wrong group
mine 283 115 4 9088021 10710125 66 18s ofn7l 17j ?
EWC 283 3214 5 9088022 23145000 66 18s ofn7l 17j ?
error in EWC:
starting SN is wrong, it really is 9088021 ending SN is wrong,
23142001-23145000 are grade 288 it appears that John Miller
shifted an extra 100 from 148 to 283, I don't know where.
mine 286 354000 225 10652001 31989000 115 6s h3n2p 7j
EWC 286 355000 226 10652001 31989000 115 6s h3n2p 7j
unresolved:
can't explain the missing run of -1000
Maybe one of the runs of 386 was counted as grade 286?
mine 287 110000 74 10656001 15883000 105 18s hfn2l 7j
EWC 287 111000 75 10656001 32657000 105 18s hfn2l 7j
error in EWC:
the last run from 32656001-32657000 is grade 387 not grade 287
mine 288 523100 296 10660001 32149000 106 18s ofn5p 7j
EWC 288 528800 295 10660001 32149000 106 18s ofn5p 7j
error in EWC:
One run (23142001-23145000) was mislisted as being 283, so the
extra run can be explained and the +3000 difference
mine 289 324000 181 10666001 24480000 115 6s h3g2p 7j
EWC 289 321000 181 10666001 24480000 115 6s h3g2p 7j
unresolved:
can't explain the +3000 difference here
mine 291 1501000 425 10674001 43622000 110 16s o3n7p 7j
EWC 291 1521500 425 10674001 43622000 110 16s o3n7p 7j
error in EWC:
There is a gap at 35604001-35624000 which is right next to a
run of 291. This gap isn't in John's list of 699, so that
accounts for the 20000
There is a gap at 36833501 36834000 500 which is right next to
a run of 291. This gap isn't in John's list of 699, so that
accounts for the 500
mine 303 2215000 371 10687001 38425000 114 12s o3n3p 7j
EWC 303 2216000 371 10687001 38425000 114 12s o3n3p 7j
unresolved:
can't explain the -1000 difference here
I suspect this is related to grade 313 as runs of these two
grades were often right next to each other and a simple off by
one error in the SN could cause this. I don't know if it is
an error in my DB or John's.
mine 309 134900 65 9786101 15589000 105 18s hfg2l 7j
EWC 309 134100 65 9786001 15589000 105 18s hfg2l 7j
error in EWC:
this is related to the 251 problems. The starting run is
wrong. this run was split into 251/309 and it looks like John
Miller took the wrong group
mine 313 524000 278 10235001 35972000 110 16s o3n7p 15j
EWC 313 523000 278 10235001 35972000 110 16s o3n7p 15j
unresolved:
can't explain the +1000 difference here
I suspect this is related to grade 303 as runs of these two
grades were often right next to each other and a simple off by
one error in the SN could cause this. I don't know if it is
an error in my DB or John's.
mine 344 164700 153 12248501 30723000 113 12s h3n2p 17j ?
EWC 344 165100 153 12248501 30723000 113 12s h3n2p 17j ?
probable error in EWC:
the run from 25398001-25398400 is grade 476 not grade 344,
which explains the -400 difference.
mine 345 736900 205 11796501 33866000 114 12s o3n3p 17j
EWC 345 737100 205 11796501 33866000 114 12s o3n3p 17j
probable error in EWC
It looks like run from 25404001-25404200 of grade 477 was
counted as grade 345
mine 386 113700 108 15543001 28573000 109 16s h3n6p 17j
EWC 386 113000 107 15543001 28573000 109 16s h3n6p 17j
unresolved:
can't explain the extra run of +700
Maybe the run at 25328301-25329001 was counted as grade 386
instead of grade 474 as they are right next to each other.
Maybe one of the runs of 386 was counted as grade 286?
mine 387 357700 228 15544001 43620000 110 16s o3n7p 17j
EWC 387 357000 227 15544001 43620000 110 16s o3n7p 17j
error in EWC:
the run from 32656001-32657000 is grade 387 not grade 287, which
explains the extra run, but adds 1000, which is 300 too much.
the run from 24771001-24771300 is grade 475 not grade 387,
which explains the -300
So, together these errors explain the "extra run of +700"
mine 469 166800 51 22027001 42992000 ? 16s s3f21p 7j ?
EWC 469 196800 51 22027001 42992000 ? 16s s3f21p 7j ?
unresolved:
can't explain the -30000 difference here
Maybe the run from 41004001-41034000 which is a hole (grade 0)
was counted as grade 469? There are also a couple of holes of
25000-2700 and a bunch of 1000-2000, so maybe it is a
combination of those?
mine 471 377500 68 24312001 37004000 ? 37s o3n1p 7j
EWC 471 371500 67 24312001 37004000 ? 37s o3n1p 7j
unresolved:
can't explain the extra run of +6000
mine 474 300 1 25328001 25328300 ? 16s ????? ?j
mine 475 300 1 24771001 24771300 ? 16s ????? ?j
mine 476 400 1 25398001 25398400 ? 12s o3n3p ?j
error in EWC
these grades really do have these runs, but are missing in EWC
mine 477 28200 26 25404001 29484000 ? 12s o3n3p 17j A3P /
EWC 477 28000 26 25404001 29484000 ? 12s o3n3p 17j A3P /
probable error in EWC
It looks like run from 25404001-25404200 of grade 477 was
counted as grade 345
mine 478 185400 90 25678001 42372000 ? 16s o3n15l 21j A5P / BWR
EWC 478 184500 90 25678001 42372000 ? 16s o3n15l 21j A5P / BWR
unresolved:
can't explain the +900 difference here
It looks like a lot of 478 runs were split into a pair of
900/100 runs with 506 with the 506 run being the 100.
maybe John got confused and miss-added one of these?
mine 480 196000 43 25369001 29700000 ? 16s ????? 7j
EWC 480 198000 42 25369001 29700000 ? 16s ????? 7j
unresolved:
can't explain the extra run of -2000 here. (would expect this to be
positive because of the extra run)
mine 483 172000 73-1 28421001 37876000 ? 18/0s -???? 17j ?
EWC 483 177000 74 28421001 37876000 ? 18/0s -???? 17j ?
unresolved:
can't explain the missing two runs of -5000 here
mine 484 557000 86-1 29164001 37885000 ? 18/0s -3n?p 15j
EWC 484 548000 84 29164001 37885000 ? 18/0s -3n?p 15j
error in EWC:
the first run of 485 starts at 31599001. It looks like John
Miller merged the run for grade 484 which starts at 31590001
in with the first run of 485. This explains the extra run of
+9000
mine 485 891000 52 31599001 35923000 ? ?s ????? ?j
EWC 485 900000 52 31590001 35923000 ? ?s ????? ?j
error in EWC:
the first run of 485 starts at 31599001. It looks like John
Miller merged the run for grade 484 which starts at 31590001
in with the first run of 485. This explains the missing -9000
mine 488 1284000 95 31601001 37899000 ? 18/0s -3f?p 7j
EWC 488 1282800 94 31601001 37899000 ? 18/0s -3f?p 7j
unresolved:
can't explain the extra run of +1200
I suspect that this is related to grade 514. There are the
follow two runs:
34557001 34558800 1800 1933 488 18/0s -3f?p 7j *
34558801 34559000 200 1933 514 18/0s s???? 7j *
Maybe John got confused and miss-added?
mine 492 144000 29 34568001 35992000 ? 20/0s -???? 17j ?
EWC 492 164000 29 34568001 35992000 ? 20/0s -???? 17j ?
probable error in EWC
There is a gap at 35563001-35583000 which is right next to a
run of 492. This gap isn't in John's list of 699, so that
accounts for the 20000
mine 493 14700 10 33655001 34681000 ? 22s o3f1p 7j
EWC 493 15700 11 33593001 34681000 ? 22s o3f1p 7j
error in EWC
the starting run at 33593001-33594000 is grade 499, not 493.
this explains the missing run of -1000
mine 499 5000 4 33312001 33594000 ? 6/0s ????? 19j ?
EWC 499 4000 3 33312001 33508000 ? 6/0s ????? 19j ?
error in EWC
the run 33593001-33594000 is grade 499, not 493. this
explains the extra run of +1000
mine 506 4600 10 33814901 34575000 ? 16s ????? 21j ? / BWR
EWC 506 5500 10 33814901 34575000 ? 16s ????? 21j ? / BWR
unresolved:
can't explain the -900 difference here
It looks like a lot of 478 runs were split into a pair of
900/100 runs with 506 with the 506 run being the 100.
maybe John got confused and miss-added one of these?
mine 514 1000 3 34515001 34847200 ? 18/0s s???? 7j
EWC 514 1200 3 34515001 34847200 ? 18/0s s???? 7j
unresolved
can't explain the -200 difference here
I suspect that this is related to grade 514. There are the
follow two runs:
34557001 34558800 1800 1933 488 18/0s -3f?p 7j *
34558801 34559000 200 1933 514 18/0s s???? 7j *
Maybe John got confused and miss-added?
mine 532 18900 15 37058001 39154000 ? 8/0s s3n?? 16j ?
EWC 532 19000 15 37058001 39154000 ? 8/0s s3n?? 16j ?
probable error in EWC
It looks like the run of 545 from 38402001-38402100 was counted as
grade 532. This explains the -100 difference
mine 533 243000 30 36978001 38992000 ? 21/0s -3f?p 17j A1P / DLX
EWC 533 223000 28 36978001 38992000 ? 21/0s -3f?p 17j A1P / DLX
unresolved:
the run from 37308001-37322000 is grade 533 not 538
can't explain the other extra run of +6000
I suspect that the run 38192001-38198000 was counted as grade
553 instead of grade 533. The area looks like this:
38173001 38175000 2000 DLX 1938 533 21/0s -3f?p 17j A1P f *
38175001 38192000 17000 1938 0 ?s ?????? 0j ? ? *
38192001 38198000 6000 DLX 1938 533 21/0s -3f?p 17j A1P f *
EWC 538 14000 1 37308001 37322000 ? 15/0s ????? 23j ?
error in EWC:
the starting run at 37308001-37322000 is grade 533 not 538
mine 545 100 1 38402001 38402100 ? ?s ????? ?j ?
EWC none
error in EWC
This run does exist.
mine 553 5000 4 37939001 38783000 ? 22s s3n1p 16j ?
EWC 553 11000 5 37939001 38783000 ? 22s s3n1p 16j ?
unresolved:
can't explain the missing run of -6000
I suspect that the run 38192001-38198000 was counted as grade
553 instead of grade 533. The area looks like this:
38173001 38175000 2000 DLX 1938 533 21/0s -3f?p 17j A1P f *
38175001 38192000 17000 1938 0 ?s ?????? 0j ? ? *
38192001 38198000 6000 DLX 1938 533 21/0s -3f?p 17j A1P f *
mine 582 206200 38 39861001 43291000 ? 16s s3f21pj 15j
EWC 582 366200 38 39861001 43291000 ? 16s s3f21pj 15j
unresolved:
can't explain the -160000 difference
Maybe the run from 40302001-40462000 which is a hole (grade 0)
was counted as grade 582? There are also a bunch of other
holes that could add up to this.
mine 626 1 1 49000000 49000000 ? 15/0s h3f?p 21j A1P / LE
mine 670 1 1 50000000 50000000 ? 15/0s h3f?p 21j Adj / LE
Not really an error:
It looks like these two runs are counted in with the "letter" section.
mine 0 10392498 86 35563001 50000000 ? ?s ?????? ?j
EWC 699 3789000 78 38003001 43613000 ? ?s ?????? ?j
unresolved:
note: Grades "0" and "699" are special "grades" used to
accurate the gaps that Elgin has in their serial number lists.
There is a gap at 35563001-35583000 which is right before a
run of 492. This gap isn't in John's list of 699, so that
accounts for the 20000
There is a gap at 35604001-35624000 which is right before a
run of 291. This gap isn't in John's list of 699, so that
accounts for the 20000
There is a gap at 36833501 36834000 which is right before a
run of 291. This gap isn't in John's list of 699, so that
accounts for the 500
There is a gap at 43627001 48999999 which isn't in John's list
of 699, so that accounts for the 5372999
There is a gap at 49000001 49999999 which isn't in John's list
of 699, so that accounts for the 999999
There is a gap at 50000001 for zero watches which isn't in
John's list of 699, so that accounts for one run.
so far, this adds up to 6 runs and 6413498 total
still missing 2 runs and 190000 total
possible explanations:
Maybe the gap at 41004001-41034000 which is right before a run
of grade 469 was counted as grade 469?
Maybe the gap at 40302001-40462000 which is right before a run
of grade 582 was counted as grade 582?
These two possible ones add up to exactly 190000 runs.
mine 533 877000 42-1 C75001 N500000 ? 21/0s -3f?p 17j A1P / DLX
EWC 533 874000 41 C75001 N500000 ? 21/0s -3f?p 17j A1P / DLX
unresolved:
can't explain the +3000 difference
mine 554 1298000 59 X609001 F937000 ? 8/0s ????? 21j ? / LE
EWC 554 1299000 58 X609001 F937000 ? 8/0s ????? 21j ? / LE
unresolved:
can't explain the extra run of -1000 (would expect this to be
positive because of the extra run)
Maybe it is these runs?
L30001 L60000 30000 LE 1944 554 8/0s ????? 21j ? f
L60001 L61000 1000 1944 0 ?s ?????? 0j ? ? *
L61001 L98000 37000 LE 1944 554 8/0s ????? 21j ? f
This would explain the "extra" run of -1000...
mine 559 517000 36-1 X672001 U946000 ? 15/0s h3f3p 21j A1P / LE
EWC 559 519000 34 X672001 U946000 ? 15/0s h3f3p 21j A1P / LE
unresolved:
can't explain the extra run of -2000 (would expect this to be
positive because of the extra run)
mine 619 635000 37 X682001 V489000 ? 21/0s -???? ?j
EWC 619 646000 37 X682001 V489000 ? 21/0s -???? ?j
unresolved:
can't explain the -11000 difference
This looks suspicious:
E782001 E792000 10000 1944 617 21/0s -???? 0j *
E792001 E803000 11000 1944 0 ?s ?????? 0j ? ? *
E803001 E813000 10000 1944 619 21/0s -???? 0j *
mine 626 441000 19-1 J313001 F402000 ? 15/0s h3f?p 21j A1P / LE
EWC 626 441001 19 J313001 F402000 ? 15/0s h3f?p 21j A1P / LE
not really an error:
Elgin doc lists one run of 1 as 49000000 and I guess John
counted it in with the "letter" section.
mine 670 31000 2 F402001 F729000 ? 15/0s h3f?p 21j Adj / LE
EWC 670 31001 3 F402001 F729000 ? 15/0s h3f?p 21j Adj / LE
not really an error:
Elgin doc lists one run of 1 as 50000000 and I guess John
counted it in with the "letter" section.
mine 0 1629000 90 X172001 F999999 ? ?s ?????? ?j
EWC 699 1621000 77
unresolved:
13 are related to the end of letter ranges
Maybe one extra run at L60001-L61000 related to grade 554?
This explains +1000
Maybe one missing run at E792001-E803000 related to grade 619
this explains +10000
but this is +4000 more than we want. Hmmm....
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